TCMprogrammer, exactly how many films in the TCM library?

[filmlover]

I am just curious, and I think others would like to know. Even a round figure would be interesting.

 

By the way. when we are asked to nominate a film to be played from the TCM library, is there a way to access the entire TCM list? The Database, while it is a fantastic reference, includes many films not in the TCM library

[filmlover]

Hi, TCMProgrammer, I noticed you were in the threads answering questions but I guessed that you probably missed this because it had slipped down the line. So I am refreshing it in hopes you will see it and answer the questions here. Thanks.

[chrtbsh]

It's a very complicated answer. Ted Turner bought the RKO, MGM pre-1986 and Warner Brothers pre-1948 libraries in the late '80s, which total about 3,500 films. When TCM launched in 1994, that was considered the "Turner library" and that was the basis for the newtork. However, in the late '90s, Turner merged with Warner Brothers, and since then they (Warner) have been the official owners of that collection of libraries. However, TCM does have an agreement with them (Warner) to play films from that library, although it isn't unlimited access in the way that it used to be. In addition, we license films from all of the other studios and independent distrubutors. As it is, about 65% - 70% comes from those 3,500 titles, and the rest come from other sources. That's the best I can do on a Sunday night.

[feaito]

Anybody knows if there's a database, maybe on the Warner site, which lists all the films that belong to Warner's current Library (including the ex-Turner Library)?

[sweetbabykmd]

That would be very helpful, seems every time I ask about a movie I'm told TCM doesn't have that movie.

[RockyRoad]

.

 

Message was edited by:

RockyRoad

[lzcutter]

The one's we see over and over and over again i.e. "The Bachelor and the Bobbysoxer" ..Mr. Blandings Builds his Dream House"..."Gentlemen Prefer Blondes"..."How to Marry a Millionaire"..."Double Indemnity"...."The Third Man"..."A Touch of Evil"....."F" for Fake......"Sabrina"....."The Odd Couple"...."The Seven Year Itch"...."Adams Rib".... "Winchester 73">>

 

RR,

 

Of those films, the only three in the Warners/Turner Library ar Bachelor, Blandings and Adams Rib.

 

All the others are rented from Fox, Universal and Paramount.

 

The database here at the TCM website lists the year and the Production Company so if you use TCM Programmers post as a guide, you can tell which films are in the Warners /Turner Library.

 

Warners/Turner Film Library includes:

All pre-1949 Warners Films (possibly all Warners now)

All RKO Films

All Pre-1986 MGM films

[sweetbabykmd]

So does this mean they have no Columbia, Paramount, 20th Century Fox, or Universals? TCM programmer says they now rent everything anyways so I would think any movie could be had.

[feaito]

Thanks for your feedback, Liz. What You say I've realized, but the thing is that among those 3,500 titles which belonged to TCM's Library (Pre 1948 WB; RKO and pre 1986 MGM) and now belong to Time-Warner, for example, not every title that you can search in the database and meets the aforementioned parameters, will necessary exist in the Library, because there are many lost/presumed lost films, especially from the 1920s (The Divine Woman, Lovers?, where the pavement ends, etc.) and 1930s (almost all the alternate language versions of early talkies, Convention City, etc), and also there are others that exist but whose rights for one reason or the other don't belong to them and cannot be aired as of today, for example: Letty Lynton, The Constant Nymph, Night Flight, etc. That's why I'd really like to know what does exist for real and in condition of potentially being scheduled.

[markfp2]

You're incorrect when you say "...I would think that any movie could be had." Many movies are not available for one reason or an other. Leasing movies for tv isn't like going down to the local Blockbuster and just picking out some titles. It's very complicated and deals may have to be made years in advance. Many titles are locked up on other channels. Even if they aren't showing them right now, they may have the rights for years to come. I work for a tv station and right now we have a number of films under contract that we can't run until 2014. Having an insight into the business, I think TCM does an amazing job at getting what they do get from outside studios.

 

As for getting a library list, I doubt that they'd release it as it would be considered proprietary business information.

 

There seems to be a lot of confusion about the TCM database. It comes from an outside source and since it lists something like 140,000 films, most of what is shown on TCM is naturally listed, but it doesn't mean they have every film in their library. I only wish they did.

[lzcutter]

TCM programmer says they now rent everything anyways so I would think any movie could be had.>>

 

Sweetbaby,

 

Unfortunately not every film can be had. Some films are tied up with rights issues. Some films are leased to other channels. Some films are lost, which means they likely don't exist anymore (especially true with silents and early talkies). A number of films prior to 1950 are considered lost because back then studios didn't have a incentive for keeping the elements and storage costs money. The original negative for Stagecoach and others were melted down for their silver content during WW2. Many of the studios have suffered vault fires over the years and films have been lost forever because of that.

 

Just because a film exists is no guarantee that the elements are in excellent shape and can be mastered for digital. Almost always, negatives have to be repaired, soundtracks have to be cleaned, negative has to be cleaned. Elements, sometimes, are in such bad shape that other sources for the material have to be found.

 

With pre-codes, many were cut shortly (including their negatives and soundtracks) after the Production Code was implemented and studios like WBros and others spend a great deal of time and $$$ looking for the cut footage in hopes of restoring the film to its Pre-Code length. Sometimes these elements are found in overseas archives or end of the line cities, someone's attic or in mislabeled cans in archives here in the States.

 

Warner Bros. recently restored "City of Conquest" only after it had located and restored the missing prequel. They continue to look for the cut scenes for "Sea Wolf" in hopes of returning the film to its original length.

 

Finally, TCM has a digital server. When TCM first started broadcasting, it was using a tape based server which had been the industry standard for years. However, with the digital age, TCM and most other networks have all converted to digital servers.

 

What this means is that in order to run a film, it has to be on a digital format. As the digital age is still fairly young, many films have yet to be converted to a digital format.

 

Until they are, TCM can not run them. Warners, Sony and Fox all understand the digital age and are going through their respective vaults, preserving and restoring and mastering on a digital format. Universal and Paramount are, as usual, bringing up the rear in this regard. Though with the long-term leases that TCM has with Paramount, someone was thinking of the future.

 

Converting a library to digital is a costly and time consuming effort that is not done quickly. Each year, the budgets are handed out that likely dictate how many films can be restored, preserved and remastered each year.

 

So, these are some of the reasons that not every film can be shown on TCM.

[grannym]

I've been trying to see Friendly Persuasion Is that film in your library

Grannym